curse necs pwn destroyers?

The other 10 or 15e skill won't cause as much damage as the echoed elite will.

Reckless Haste exists but don't forget you need to cast it *twice* to cover one use of SS. It's been nerfed more or less into oblivion - a 15e adjacent-AoE spell causing a higher miss rate for 12 seconds. Reckless will also not increase the damage output in hard mode.

First of all 10 seconds isn't exactly a short recharge time. Second, if you can choose, do you prefer killing fast or killing slow? Third, you forget that Arcane Echo isn't just utility for SS but for your entire bar, almost whatever spells you bring. I'm sorry arcane echo just seems pointless to me. Reckless haste is pointless in HM,except for running PoF, because they already have an attack and movement speed buff. Very rarely do I actually have to wait for the entire 10 second recharge. More often than not the HRT mod kicks in and it's only a 5 second recharge. I prefer to use Price of Failure in place of echo just because I can spread it around about as effectively as I can spread SS around because the HRT mod helps so much. Then with all the missing they are doing and SS triggering prior to the skill actually going off you're looking at pretty much the same damage output. Try it sometime. With the right mods on your staff or wand and focus whichever you prefer it's possible to run without arcane echo.

I'm sorry arcane echo just seems pointless to me. Reckless haste is pointless in HM,except for running PoF, because they already have an attack and movement speed buff. Very rarely do I actually have to wait for the entire 10 second recharge. More often than not the HRT mod kicks in and it's only a 5 second recharge. I prefer to use Price of Failure in place of echo just because I can spread it around about as effectively as I can spread SS around because the HRT mod helps so much. Then with all the missing they are doing and SS triggering prior to the skill actually going off you're looking at pretty much the same damage output. Try it sometime. With the right mods on your staff or wand and focus whichever you prefer it's possible to run without arcane echo. I'm sorry but an AoE 50% miss chance is pointless?

Even with two HSR mods the chance of halving skill recharge time isn't 40%. your right. its 36% with a 4% chance of fourth recharge time.

Echo + SS is pointless with the right equipment. The recharge is not unmangeable and basically all you do is put a 15e skill in your bar that isn't going to be directly adding to your damage output. With a HRT mod on my curses staff I'm able to spread SS around just as effectively as an echo SS build can without killing my energy with that unnecessary expenditure for the echo spell. Perhaps I'm just ignorant but I thought the whole point was to make the enemies die fast, as fast as possible so they can't kill you. I'd rather have more direct damage than a limited copy of a skill I already have in my bar. MoP causes about the same scatter as SS now BTW. That update is ages old. People kept whining about it so they finally made SS cause the scatter effect as well. Right, well groups of enemies die in the time that the first SS recharges so I'm pretty sure echo'ing it would be far more efficient than relying on a 20% or 2 20% recharge items to make it recharge faster. It seems whatever group setup you're using doesn't kill things as fast so I guess your method works for what you're doing.

your right. its 36% with a 4% chance of fourth recharge time. Can't break half recharge. So in the end, it's still 40% chance to halve recharge.

The chance to get any lowering of recharge time with a 20/20 set is 36% and not 40%.

I believe they call it "mathematics". You're forgetting the quarter (both chances trigger) recharge, which can't break the 50% recharge limit imposed by ArenaNet. Saying 36% is correct is assuming that the 4% of quarter recharge (which subsequently becomes only a half due to a hard limit) is IGNORED.

It's not ignored, so your "mathematics" is flawed.

Kale, not sure about your mathematics.

4% on a quarter recharge (0.2*0.2, both mods trigger)
32% on half recharge (0.8*0.2+0.2*0.8, one mod triggers)
64% on no faster recharge (0.8*0.8, no mod triggers)

The chance is 32% for half recharge, 4% for quarter recharge.

As there is no quarter recharge possible due to the 50% recharge limit that ANet introduced, it becomes 36%.


-- Plz go back to the topic! -- I was reading Coloneh's post wrong, my bad.